Episode 133
Reversing Chronic Disease: Insights from Dr. Lufkin
The salient focus of our discussion today revolves around the transformative potential of lifestyle changes in reclaiming metabolic health, as articulated by our esteemed guest, Dr. Robert Lufkin. As a distinguished physician, professor, and New York Times bestselling author, Dr. Lufkin has dedicated his career to empowering individuals to confront chronic diseases through informed lifestyle choices rather than solely relying on conventional pharmaceuticals. He shares his own journey of overcoming four chronic ailments, illustrating how these conditions can be reversed through strategic lifestyle modifications. Furthermore, Dr. Lufkin emphasizes the interconnectedness of chronic diseases, elucidating how addressing root causes such as insulin resistance and inflammation can mitigate a range of health issues. Our conversation not only seeks to illuminate the efficacy of these lifestyle interventions but also aims to foster a paradigm shift in how we approach health and wellness in contemporary society.
Dr. Robert Lufkin, a prominent physician and author, shares his transformative journey from chronic illness to health advocate, shedding light on the critical issue of metabolic health. His personal experiences serve as a catalyst for broader discussions about the alarming rise of chronic diseases in modern society, including diabetes, obesity, and hypertension. Dr. Lufkin articulates the inadequacies of conventional Western medicine in addressing these conditions, advocating for a fundamental shift towards lifestyle interventions as a primary means of prevention and reversal.
The conversation delves into the interconnectedness of various chronic diseases, highlighting common root causes such as insulin resistance and systemic inflammation. Dr. Lufkin emphasizes the importance of understanding these underlying mechanisms rather than merely treating symptoms in isolation. He encourages listeners to adopt a proactive approach to their health, leveraging insights from his latest book, 'Metabolic Health and Longevity,' which provides practical guidance for achieving better health outcomes through informed lifestyle choices. This episode serves as a crucial reminder of the empowering potential of personal agency in health management, urging individuals to take control of their well-being and make conscious decisions that promote long-term health.
Furthermore, Dr. Lufkin critiques the current healthcare paradigm, which often prioritizes pharmacological solutions over holistic approaches. He argues that true health cannot be achieved solely through medication, but rather through a comprehensive understanding of one's lifestyle and its impact on overall well-being. This discussion not only educates on the significance of metabolic health but also inspires listeners to become active participants in their health journeys, fostering a movement towards greater awareness and proactive health management.
Takeaways
- Dr. Robert Lufkin elucidates the profound impact of lifestyle on metabolic health and chronic disease reversal.
- The podcast emphasizes the importance of understanding root causes of chronic diseases rather than merely treating symptoms.
- Lufkin advocates for a dietary approach that reduces carbohydrate intake to manage and potentially reverse type 2 diabetes.
- The discussion highlights the interconnectedness of chronic diseases, underscoring the significance of holistic health management strategies.
- Dr. Robert Lufkin emphasizes the critical influence of lifestyle choices on metabolic health and chronic disease management.
- The podcast discusses how lifestyle interventions can reverse chronic diseases, contrary to traditional medical approaches focusing solely on medications.
- Lufkin's journey through chronic illness led to a transformative understanding of the importance of addressing the root causes of diseases.
- The conversation highlights the alarming rise of chronic diseases in the 21st century and the necessity of proactive health measures to combat them.
- Dr. Lufkin advocates for reevaluating dietary guidelines, suggesting that conventional wisdom may contribute to worsening health outcomes.
- The episode underscores the empowering message that individuals have the agency to take control of their health through informed lifestyle choices.
Transcript
My guest today, Dr.
Speaker A:Robert Lufkin is a physician, medical school professor at UCLA and USC and a new York Times best selling author empowering people to take back their metabolic health with lifestyle and other tools.
Speaker A:A veteran of the Today show and USA Today and a regular contributor to Fox and other news network news stations, his weekly video podcast reaches over 400,000 people.
Speaker A:After reversing chronic disease and transforming his own life, he is making it his mission to help others do the same.
Speaker A:His latest book, metabolic Health and Longevity is an instant New York Times bestseller as reframed our thinking about metabolic health and longevity.
Speaker A:In addition to practicing medicine, he is the author of over 200 peer reviewed scientific papers, 14 books available in 13 languages.
Speaker A:His social media posts have over 400,000 followers worldwide.
Speaker A:We welcome him to the podcast.
Speaker A:Well, Doctor, welcome to the podcast.
Speaker A:How you doing today?
Speaker B:Great.
Speaker B:Great.
Speaker B:It's so nice, so great to be on your program.
Speaker B:Dr.
Speaker B:Keith.
Speaker A:Well, thank you.
Speaker A:I'm looking forward to this conversation.
Speaker A:Love talking about these topics and we all need to get better, a little bit more healthy.
Speaker A:So this should be a fascinating conversation.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, can't wait.
Speaker A:So I'm going to ask you my favorite question.
Speaker A:What's the best piece of advice you've ever received?
Speaker B:Wow, that's.
Speaker B:I guess I know, just shooting from the hip.
Speaker B:I was going to say pay attention.
Speaker A:Really important if you're a doctor.
Speaker A:I love it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Just, I mean, seriously, seriously, to be, to be open minded and realize that at least as far as science is going, it's a moving target.
Speaker B:Everything is changing and what we thought we KNEW, you know, five years ago, 10 years ago, may not be, may not be the best way to approach things anymore.
Speaker B:And just to keep an open mind, a beginner's mind as we look at things fresh and are open to new ways of looking at things.
Speaker A:I love that.
Speaker A:I'm also curious, just looking at your background and your years of experience, are there some people in your life who served as a mentor for you or even a guide in your journey?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, other than, you know, obviously my parents, of course, but other people there was, my training is in radiology.
Speaker B:So one, one gentleman was a radiologist I worked with for many, many years and he sort of took me under his wing and I learned a great deal from him.
Speaker B:His name's William Hanafi and he just, I mean I learned a lot from about radiology, but also about life and the way he approached things.
Speaker B:You know, as with any great mentor, we oftentimes learn a lot more than just the subject matter, it's more about a way of being, a way to exist in the universe.
Speaker A:I love that.
Speaker A:So I'm looking at your background.
Speaker A:Can you share some of your personal experience from your time as a professor at UCLA and usc and what influenced you as you wrote these great books you have out on health?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, the, the most recent book, the Lies I Taught in Medical School, what, what made me, what, what compelled me to write this book was that I was, I was going along minding my own business as a professor, where I got to not only teach medical students and doctors and oftentimes it's not learn from them more than I taught them, but also do research and conduct.
Speaker B:I've written many peer reviewed scientific papers.
Speaker B:My lab has been paid by drug companies and device makers and the nih, National Institutes of Health to do research and then also to literally practice medicine and actually see patients, which is very fulfilling.
Speaker B:So it is a great job being a medical school professor.
Speaker B:But what changed for me was I came down with four chronic diseases that were unexpected.
Speaker B:And I went to my doctor and I was prescribed, like so many people, prescription medicines for each one of these diseases.
Speaker B:And you know, I said, hey, are there any other options?
Speaker B:You know, what about lifestyle or anything else?
Speaker B:And they said, nah, that doesn't really work.
Speaker B:You know, you're going to be on these pills for the rest of your life, so get used to it.
Speaker B:And that, that was what really compelled me to look closer at the things that I believed that I'd been teaching, that many of my colleagues were still teaching about, about these chronic diseases.
Speaker B:And that's, that's really the theme of this, this whole book.
Speaker B:And if I, if I could take a moment and just sort of set the stage on this, I mean, I, I'm a product of Western sort of allopathic medicine, if you will.
Speaker B:But this book is very critical of Western medicine.
Speaker B:And I have to say I'm still a fan of Western medicine despite the book.
Speaker B:I mean, if I get hit by a car and I need a blood transfusion and I need my spleen removed and I need surgery, I want the best that Western medicine has to offer.
Speaker B:And in fact, Western medicine transformed our lives in the 20th century.
Speaker B:You know, truly, the pills, the surgeries that were developed, and also largely through public health measures with infectious disease and all, it's made the world truly a better place for all of us.
Speaker B:But the problem is in the 21st century, where we are now a quarter of the way into it, we're facing literally A tsunami of what are called chronic diseases.
Speaker B:And these are diseases that were present in the 20th century, but nowhere near in the almost biblical proportions.
Speaker B:The numbers that they're coming now, and these are familiar diseases.
Speaker B:We've heard of things like, things like obesity.
Speaker B:Today, most people in the United States are either obese or overweight.
Speaker B:Diabetes, type 2 diabetes, most people, up to a half people are either pre diabetic or type 2 diabetic.
Speaker B:And the numbers are growing.
Speaker B:Hypertension, cancer, heart attack, stroke, Alzheimer's disease, even mental illness.
Speaker B:This whole umbrella of chronic diseases is exploding and the numbers are taking off.
Speaker B:And the problem is when western medicine takes the pills and the surgeries that were so effective during the 20th century and really transformed our lives, they don't really work on the chronic diseases.
Speaker B:In other words, they may treat the symptoms and prevent us from dying in the moment.
Speaker B:But in many, many of these diseases, I would say the majority of them, they don't reverse the underlying disease and the disease continues to get worse and worse and worse.
Speaker B:And that's what I was facing when I had four of these chronic diseases.
Speaker B:So I basically went back to the, went back to the literature and did a deep dive not to make the world a better place, but more out of self preservation, because I didn't want to die myself, you know, And I realized that, that, that knowledge has moved on, that there, there are breakthroughs in our understanding that these chronic diseases actually do respond to lifestyle.
Speaker B:They actually and lifestyle can reverse and push back these chronic diseases the way no pills in surgery actually can.
Speaker B:And long story short, I began doing relatively simple lifestyle changes myself and I was able to reverse these four chronic diseases in myself to the point where I went off all medications for them.
Speaker B:My doctors couldn't believe it.
Speaker B:They thought the labs were broken or something like that.
Speaker B:And now I've made it my mission literally, to help other people take back their lives, their health, their wellness, and not make the same mistakes that, that I've made.
Speaker B:And that's the purpose of writing this book and help getting the message out.
Speaker A:So let's dig a little deeper into some of the root causes.
Speaker A:You mentioned that you had four chronic diseases and you had to get to the root cause of them.
Speaker A:So kind of walk us through some of the root causes, some of the most common illnesses that people are dealing with today.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:This whole concept of root cause, it sort of goes against a lot of the way medicine is still taught today.
Speaker B:In other words, I mentioned that list of chronic diseases and they seem like very separate diseases.
Speaker B:How Is diabetes and blood sugar metabolism related to something like mental health or Alzheimer's disease or cancer?
Speaker B:But as it turns out, they are all fundamentally related at a basic root cause.
Speaker B:In other words, there are, there are underlying primary mechanisms that, that drive all of these diseases across the board.
Speaker B:These mechanisms are things like insulin resistance, things like inflammation, things like oxidation.
Speaker B:And the, the fascinating thing is when we develop strategies, in particular lifestyle strategies, to, to reverse these root causes, then our chance for all the chronic diseases decreases.
Speaker B:In other words, the same lifestyle that helps me not get obesity and diabetes also reduces my risk for Alzheimer's disease and mental illness and arthritis like gout or osteoarthritis and polycystic ovary disease if I'm a woman.
Speaker B:And on and on and on.
Speaker B:So it's, it just underscores how important it is about addressing the root cause and then how important it is to pay attention to our lifestyle.
Speaker B:I mean, one other kind of wake up call I had in writing this book was, you know, as a doctor, I thought that, I thought that a disease starts when I diagnose it.
Speaker B:In other words, as a patient, when I walked into a doctor's office, the doctor, he or she says, okay, you've got diabetes, you know, and boom, I have it.
Speaker B:And a week ago I didn't, right?
Speaker B:And a year ago I didn't, but now I have it.
Speaker B:And that's the way our healthcare system is set up.
Speaker B:Insurance has to work that way and everything.
Speaker B:It's like, oh, you forgot your keys and we do some tests and oh, you've got Alzheimer's disease.
Speaker B:And I'm not trying to make light of any of these very serious diseases, but I'm just trying to help get the message across.
Speaker B:But the wake up call for me is what I didn't realize is that even though the doctor defines these diseases as starting at a certain point in time when you, when you're in the doctor's office.
Speaker B:If I as a patient wait until the doctor diagnoses them, these diseases don't actually begin when the doctor diagnoses them.
Speaker B:The chronic diseases I mentioned, there's very good evidence for that.
Speaker B:They begin weeks to years to literally decades before the doctor makes a diagnosis.
Speaker B:What does that mean?
Speaker B:Well, if I, if I sit around and say, hey, I'm healthy, my doctor says I don't have any diseases.
Speaker B:If I, if I take that attitude and I wait for the doctor to diagnose one of these diseases before I start changing my lifestyle and, and do these things, I'm, I'm Missing a huge opportunity for prevention.
Speaker B:And, and I have less chance of reversing them down the line when I, when, when I finally do get them.
Speaker B:So the idea is that these lifestyle changes are not just for people when you get the disease, but there's a benefit for everyone to begin looking at how they can improve their lives before they have the diagnosis.
Speaker A:So let's pick one of those for us.
Speaker A:Say you are dealing with type 2 diabetes.
Speaker A:What lifestyle changes would you suggest for someone who may be pre diabetic or has type 2 diabetes?
Speaker A:What kind of lifestyle recommendations would you start with?
Speaker B:That's a great, a great choice, Keith.
Speaker B:And actually, full disclosure, One of those four diseases for me was type 2 diabetes.
Speaker B:It was pre diabetic.
Speaker B:I was diagnosed with that.
Speaker B:So I'm just going to tell, I'll tell you two options, two ways of treating type 2 diabetes, and then your listeners can decide which way they want to do it.
Speaker B:The Stand Type 2 diabetes is an abnormality of blood sugar metabolism.
Speaker B:You know, we hear diabetes and all.
Speaker B:And type 2 diabetes is the most common type.
Speaker B:90% of diabetes is type 2 diabetes.
Speaker B:And it's driven by something that I mentioned before called insulin resistance.
Speaker B:Insulin is a hormone that controls blood sugar.
Speaker B:And anyway, type 2 diabetes, the problem is, the acute problem that will kill you instantly or very shortly is when your blood sugar gets out of control and gets very high.
Speaker B:This hyperglycemia can be fatal.
Speaker B:And so doctors have come up with things like insulin that can keep you from dying from hyperglycemia and allow you to survive type 2 diabetes.
Speaker B:And the problem is that type 2 diabetes isn't just hyperglycemia, high blood sugar, but if you treat it with insulin, it continues to progress down the road.
Speaker B:What does that mean?
Speaker B:Well, there are other things that happen, things like what's the number one cause of surgical amputations in the United States today?
Speaker B:It's diabetes, foot amputations and everything.
Speaker B:What's the number one cause of renal failure, kidney failure and dialysis?
Speaker B:Type 2 diabetes.
Speaker B:What's the number one cause of retinal blindness?
Speaker B:Type 2 diabetes, and on and on.
Speaker B:It's a risk factor for all these diseases.
Speaker B:So the problem is modern medicine treats diabetes with drugs.
Speaker B:You know, initially metformin and some other drugs, and then later on insulin.
Speaker B:The problem is that when we do that, we control the disease, we don't reverse it.
Speaker B:And by controlling the disease, it continues to progress.
Speaker B:And even though you don't die of this hyperglycemia, these progressive changes occur down the road.
Speaker B:And your Lifespan is still shortened.
Speaker B:Okay, that's one treatment option.
Speaker B:That's the option the American Diabetic association recommends, and that's the option that most people are offered.
Speaker B:There's another option that, that people can do diabetes.
Speaker B:The reason people get diabetes, it's an abnormality of blood sugar, and it's abnormality of insulin, which is the hormone that controls blood sugar.
Speaker B:There are three macronutrients that your audience may be aware of.
Speaker B:There are three basic food types, fats and proteins which are required for life.
Speaker B:If we don't eat those, we die.
Speaker B:We have to eat those in our diet.
Speaker B:And then the third group is called carbohydrates, and they're.
Speaker B:Interestingly, they're not required in our diet.
Speaker B:In other words, there are human populations that eat very few carbohydrates and they do just fine.
Speaker B:As it turns out, the carbohydrates, which contain things like sugar and starch and flour and these kinds of things, are actually the primary driver of insulin and insulin resistance.
Speaker B:In other words, protein and fat don't really affect insulin much, but the carbohydrates do.
Speaker B:And driving the insulin up with carbohydrates is one of the root causes for type 2 diabetes.
Speaker B:So much to the point that if you take a type 2 diabetic, you take a group of type 2 diabetes and diabetics, and this has been done in controlled studies, and you.
Speaker B:You restrict the amount of carbohydrates they eat in a significant proportion of them, most of them, they will be able to not control their diabetes, but they will be able to reverse it to the point that they get off the medications.
Speaker B:And importantly, diabetes doesn't become a chronic, progressive disease like it does when we control it with medications, you know, leading to amputation, blindness, all that.
Speaker B:It goes to sleep, it goes away, it kind of.
Speaker B:It goes into what we call remission.
Speaker B:So in most cases, it doesn't progress like that.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So we have two options there, two ways to treat it.
Speaker B:But the problem is the today, the mainstream accepted way to treat type 2 diabetes, and, you know, for a number of reasons, is through medications and the diet.
Speaker B:The diet approach isn't emphasized enough and in some cases isn't even communicated well as an alternative to patients.
Speaker B:So they, you know, they don't know that.
Speaker B:That it's, you know, cut and dried like that.
Speaker B:And that's just one of the chronic diseases, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker A:Excuse me.
Speaker A:I also have heard that type 2 diabetes is a precursor oftentimes, and I could Be wrong.
Speaker A:I'm not.
Speaker A:My degree is that in medicine.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But it's a precursor to Alzheimer's.
Speaker A:So it's somehow connected, the type 2 diabetes.
Speaker A:Is that what the studies are showing as well?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:All of the diseases I mentioned share a root cause, share these root causes of metabolic dysfunction, which include insulin resistance and all these things.
Speaker B:So type 2 diabetes in itself is a risk factor for obesity and vice versa, and hypertension and Alzheimer's disease.
Speaker B:In fact, Alzheimer's disease shows abnormal blood glucose metabolism in the brain, and some scientists refer to Alzheimer's as type 3 diabetes.
Speaker B:So by having this, you increase your risk at all.
Speaker B:But the point is they're all linked together.
Speaker B:So adopting a diet which is healthy for type 2 diabetes will also improve.
Speaker B:The same thing improves your chances for Alzheimer's disease, mental illness, cancer, hypertension, heart attack, stroke, all those things.
Speaker B:And it's interesting, we want to pay attention to these chronic diseases because they're exploding, right?
Speaker B:Everybody's getting them now.
Speaker B:But, but the other thing, these chronic diseases are the diseases that you and I and most of your listeners are going to die of, statistically.
Speaker B:I mean, let's face it, we all have to die of something, right?
Speaker B:No one gets out alive, so we can't not have anything.
Speaker B:But if you look at the list of diseases that people die of, it's a very short list, and it includes basically heart attack and stroke, cancer, Alzheimer's disease, and a couple other things after that.
Speaker B:But statistically, most of us are going to die of one of those chronic diseases that are driven by lifestyle.
Speaker B:So if these are the diseases that we're absolutely going to get, there's no way to avoid it.
Speaker B:Why not take a lifestyle now that will push that back?
Speaker B:I mean, I don't want to get it when I'm 55.
Speaker B:I don't want to get it when I'm 85.
Speaker B:I don't want to get it when I'm 105.
Speaker B:You know, let's, let's push it back.
Speaker A:I love that.
Speaker A:You know, it's interesting.
Speaker A:I'm glad I had you on now because the talk in America right now is really focused on making America healthy again.
Speaker A:And there's so much talk about chronic diseases, there's so much talk about what's in our food systems.
Speaker A:As you are writing this book, what kind of response are you getting from people who are now all of a sudden maybe paying a little bit more attention to their health and saying that there are other ways, more natural ways to deal with some of the Chronic diseases that we're having.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, I, I, I love the fact that on a, on a national level that, that national level politicians are suddenly talking about chronic disease.
Speaker B:They're talking about carbohydrates and they're talking about seed oils, they're talking about lifestyle and junk food.
Speaker B:And, you know, it's so great to see that.
Speaker B:I'm disappointed that it's become politicized almost.
Speaker B:I mean, you know, it's because our health is not a political thing, really.
Speaker B:It doesn't matter whether you're a Democrat or you're Republican.
Speaker B:It all works the same.
Speaker B:These diseases don't.
Speaker B:They don't matter.
Speaker B:You know, it doesn't matter what your political affiliation is.
Speaker A:They don't pick party lines and go to attack.
Speaker B:Exactly, exactly.
Speaker B:So, but it is great.
Speaker B:I mean, it's coming up in the consciousness that people are being more aware because a lot of it is.
Speaker B:People just don't know that.
Speaker B:I mean, if I walk into school at my daughter's elementary school and I light a cigarette and hand it to her, 15 parents will jump me and wrestle me to the floor.
Speaker B:But if I hand her a bowl of sugar cereal and pour chocolate milk on it and give it to her for breakfast, everyone will smile and nod like, what a great dad.
Speaker B:When they realize, you know, that this is, this is really harmful stuff.
Speaker B:And, you know, you're starting on a lifetime of junk food that does have metabolic consequences for all the diseases we mentioned.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's exactly right.
Speaker A:I'm curious, how are your colleagues taking your findings and researching your book?
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a great question.
Speaker B:Well, I still have my job as a professor at the medical schools, at least last time I looked.
Speaker B:But, you know, part of it is it's hard to get above the noise.
Speaker B:Like, you know, nobody, you know, you think you've written something.
Speaker B:You know you're going to not change the world, but you're going to get, everyone's going to jump on you.
Speaker B:Well, it's very, very hard to get, to break away from, you know, get above the thing.
Speaker B:I mean, we were fortunate.
Speaker B:We were very lucky.
Speaker B:This book became a New York Times bestseller, which, which is, you know, unexpected and very, very lucky for us.
Speaker B:That got us a lot of attention that we wouldn't have gotten otherwise.
Speaker B:But, but to your question, most of my colleagues, I think, I think reasonable people can agree to disagree.
Speaker B:And that's, you know, that's the kind of thing, because these are not my ideas in the book.
Speaker B:I just present the research that I've seen it.
Speaker B:I show the scientific articles and I tell you why I'm interpreting it this way and what the evidence to the best that I can do, it shows.
Speaker B:And if somebody disagrees with my interpretation of the evidence, that's okay, you know, that's, it's not personal.
Speaker B:And I know over the years I've changed my thinking, you know, so many times.
Speaker B:I'm probably going to, you know, hopefully I'll continue to change my thinking will evolve as we learn new stuff because I mean, wow, the knowledge in this space is accelerating like never before I've seen in my career, which is a long career but in the last 10 years, the last five years, it's only getting faster and faster and faster.
Speaker B:Part of it's, you know, of course the Internet and then AI on top of it and just our knowledge is exploding.
Speaker B:It's, it's harder and harder to keep up with everything.
Speaker A:No, it's, you're right about that.
Speaker A:And I wonder how much this is.
Speaker A:Again, my observation from afar is because there's so much, so much pharmaceutical dollars in the treatments that we have.
Speaker A:It's also hard to get that out of medicine when that's such a part of it.
Speaker A:Like I was just, I just saw the doctor who talked about the danger of statins when you're treating high cholesterol.
Speaker A:And you know, he's talking about, you know that that's our automatic go to thing is let's give people statins.
Speaker A:And it may not be the best route because it doesn't really, doesn't really reduce.
Speaker A:That was his, his is his study.
Speaker A:It doesn't, doesn't significantly reduce the risk of heart attack.
Speaker A:The statins actually didn't have much impact at all on most people.
Speaker A:It was a very small percentage that were actually impacted.
Speaker A:So he was talking about we need to be careful of how we.
Speaker A:Going back where you said, how do we treat the chronic underlining issue, not just dealing with managing the chronic disease.
Speaker B:Yeah, the whole thing on statins, I've got a whole chapter in the book on that.
Speaker B:But you're absolutely right.
Speaker B:The benefits of statins are greatly exaggerated by the pharmaceutical companies.
Speaker B:They use relative risk instead of absolute risk and different sort of statistical alchemy they use, but they exaggerate the benefits and they minimize the side effects which are not insignificant.
Speaker B:But to your point about the influence of pharmaceuticals, I mean back to your question, there are only two countries in the world that allow pharmaceuticals to advertise directly to patients for prescription drugs.
Speaker B:And the reason that there are only Two countries is because of the harm that it does.
Speaker B:And the two countries are New Zealand and the United States.
Speaker B:And interestingly, this new wave of healthcare reform, one of the things that they've talked about doing is outlawing pharmaceutical ads in the United States, which would be a huge step that no Republicans or Democrats have done for 20 years or so because it corrupts the news services.
Speaker B:You've got CNN running all these ads and then they're basically paid for by the pharmaceutical companies.
Speaker B:And then the pharmaceutical influence is pervasive in medical education.
Speaker B:They say dietitians, who determine our food choices and our nutritional advice.
Speaker B:Dietitian education is paid for by junk food makers, basically.
Speaker B:My mom was a dietitian.
Speaker B:She goes to her conferences and it's sponsored by McDonald's and Coca Cola.
Speaker B:And you know what, what could go wrong?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Well, in medical education, it's even worse.
Speaker B:It's sponsored by pharmaceutical companies.
Speaker B:So, you know, it's.
Speaker B:The influence is really, is really pervasive and it's difficult to untangle it and get to the science.
Speaker A:It's interesting too, you mentioned that, because I've had arguments with.
Speaker A:Not arguments, but we've had disagreements with my doctor about numbers are here, so we should automatically do that.
Speaker A:I'm like, no, I don't like the science of what you're suggesting.
Speaker A:And so we debate back and forth of there's gotta be a different way than just getting on 17 different drugs for marginal test results.
Speaker A:And so we, we respectfully disagree oftentimes.
Speaker A:But as a patient, when you're going into your doctor and you say, I don't want to go down the medical rabbit hole.
Speaker A:I heard, I talked to another doctor on my show before, say sometimes they label you as a difficult patient.
Speaker A:So as a patient, how do you have this conversation with your doctor where you.
Speaker A:They don't label you as a problem, problem child, but someone who's actually looking for more, more natural or alternative ways to treat chronic disease.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a great question.
Speaker B:The tendency is for, you know, if Western sort of allopathic, which is kind of mainstream medicine is set up is they.
Speaker B:You run a bunch of tests, you find an abnormality, you prescribe something that will, you know, palliated or reverse it or surgery if necessary.
Speaker B:And that's the model.
Speaker B:You give it a name, you give it a disease, then you prescribe.
Speaker B:There are certain drugs for each one, and that's the problem.
Speaker B:There's another type of medicine or sort of specialty of medicine called functional medicine or integrative medicine that tends to take a more holistic approach.
Speaker B:Approach.
Speaker B:So if you, if you find a doctor with that, that sort of approach, they'll be more likely to look at, oh, wow, maybe you have toxins in your environment, you have mercury, you have lead, you have Lyme disease, you have mold.
Speaker B:You know, these things instead of just giving you a drug for your headache or something like that.
Speaker B:I mean, you know, as a doctor, I know even though I'm a doctor, that doctors don't make.
Speaker B:Doctors don't make me healthy.
Speaker B:Doctors only make me less sick.
Speaker B:And if I want to be healthy, it's on me because it's about lifestyle and it's the choices that, that I make.
Speaker B:Literally every day when I get up, I'm empowered.
Speaker B:What I'm going to eat, am I going to exercise, am I going to, you know, how I sleep, how I live my life, how I, how I look at the world.
Speaker B:Is the world a beautiful place full of love and opportunity, or is it a scary place full of danger and threats and harm coming to me?
Speaker B:All these things matter.
Speaker B:And actually all of these are about a healthy lifestyle that will then literally transfer, I believe, into reducing the risk for all these chronic diseases and in many cases, getting off the drugs.
Speaker B:Like, like I was, like I was doing.
Speaker B:I was on four prescription drugs and I was able to get off all of them or, or decrease the need for them in the future.
Speaker B:Even so, it's, it's not easy though, because it's.
Speaker B:Doctors are different depending on their approach, and you have to find one that's aligned to you.
Speaker B:If you're a problem patient, you probably have a problem doctor and it's time for a new one.
Speaker A:Yes, there's probably time.
Speaker A:I'm curious, as you have released this book, Lies I Taught in Medical School.
Speaker A:How do you hope this book influences the medical community and just patient care going forward?
Speaker B:Well, it's obviously a clickbait title topic to get people's attention, right?
Speaker B:But I want people to look at things that we've just got wrong and understand, like I said before, that we don't have everything right.
Speaker B:And we have made mistakes and we're continuing to make mistakes in medical practice, and it's okay.
Speaker B:We need to acknowledge them and move forward.
Speaker B:Maybe a low fat, high carbohydrate diet, which has been recommended for 60 years for heart disease, is not a good thing and it's making people sicker and fatter and diabetes, let's admit it and let's move on.
Speaker B:And you know, and that's the idea just Sort of a mea culpa, you know, and that, hey, it's okay to admit mistakes.
Speaker B:It's okay, you know, to get things wrong, as long as we, you know, work as hard as we can to do the best we can to get them right.
Speaker A:I love that.
Speaker A:I love to ask my guest this other, this is my other favorite question.
Speaker A:What legacy do you want to leave behind?
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:I mean, separate from family and children and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker B:I think just what, what I just said, sort of the idea that, you know, that, that it's okay to constantly be questioning things, to always ask questions, you know, as any good student should do.
Speaker B:And as doctors, we should do the same thing as patients, we should do the same thing.
Speaker B:We should constantly question things, question the science, because it will change, it is changing.
Speaker B:And what we think we know today is going to be different, guaranteed.
Speaker B:As we understand reality better, we have different models for reality.
Speaker B:We're going to figure it out and do a better job.
Speaker B:But we have to be open to those things.
Speaker B:We can't be dogmatic and locked into our beliefs too much.
Speaker A:So you have any upcoming projects you want to tell us about?
Speaker A:Any books on the horizon?
Speaker B:Yeah, no.
Speaker B:This book, I still working on it.
Speaker B:I'm enjoying it.
Speaker B:I'm working with a lot of different companies setting up lifestyle programs for people where they can, you know, easily get access to information.
Speaker B:There's, there, there's so much available now.
Speaker B:These, these CGMs, which are continuous glucose monitors, which are little things you put on your arm.
Speaker B:I'm wearing one now, but it, it allows me to read out my blood sugar on my, you know, on my phone.
Speaker B:And it used to be in the United States up until just a few weeks ago.
Speaker B:Only diabetics could get these with a doctor's prescription.
Speaker B:I'm not diabetic.
Speaker B:I mean, since I've changed my lifestyle, my blood sugars are normal now.
Speaker B:I'm not.
Speaker B:No meds for it.
Speaker B:So my, you know, I'm in remission, but I wear this to track my metabolic health.
Speaker B:I, I see what foods will spike my glucose, which is a bad thing.
Speaker B:You know, we want to keep our glucose at a nice level like that to avoid those things.
Speaker B:So different things like these CGMs, anyway, a few weeks ago are now available for the first time the United States in history without a doctor's prescription.
Speaker B:So you can just, you can order them from online and, you know, put them on.
Speaker B:They last two weeks.
Speaker B:But there are more and more tools that are becoming available.
Speaker B:So I'm I'm super excited about, about all these things happening.
Speaker A:That's really neat, Doc.
Speaker A:Anything I haven't asked you that I should have asked you?
Speaker B:Um, let's see.
Speaker B:No, I think we, we covered well.
Speaker B:Yes, it is.
Speaker B:How could people find out about me and download my free book chapter?
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker B:I, if you, if you're curious about this book, I have a.
Speaker B:The first chapter is free on audio and PDF format.
Speaker B:You can go to my website and download it.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:My website is Robert Lufkin.
Speaker B:L U F K I n m d.com I'm very active on social media.
Speaker B:My wife says too active, but please look for me and say hi.
Speaker A:That's great.
Speaker A:As you wrap up this conversation, are there some key takeaways you want to leave with the audience before we wrap up?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, the lifestyle matters and it, this, it was a wakeup call for me.
Speaker B:It probably, probably the single most powerful medicine that, that I will ever use and most of us will use are the, are the lifestyle choices we make.
Speaker B:And it's, it's a new era in medicine.
Speaker B:It's not that doctors aren't important and they don't matter.
Speaker B:You know, certainly, you know, if I have a serious disease like I talked about, they can manage it.
Speaker B:But as far as improving my chances of getting those disease and my overall health and wellness, I'm in charge because no doctor could do my lifestyle for me.
Speaker B:And as I said, it's, it's a new day.
Speaker B:Every single morning when I wake up, I get to decide what I'm going to eat, when I'm going to exercise, when I'm going to sleep, what I get to do.
Speaker B:And it's an empowering time.
Speaker B:I think the idea of me as a patient being the CEO of my own health is a really empowering thing.
Speaker B:We have agency now and doctors are important, but they're a little bit less important now.
Speaker B:They're more consultants for us as we take control of our own health and there are more and more tools to make this possible for all of us.
Speaker A:Well, Robert, thanks so much for coming on and sharing your journey with us and your story and hopefully we'll take your book and we'll all read it and we'll live better, healthier lives and lifestyle.
Speaker A:So thank you for sharing what you do.
Speaker B:Thanks so much, Keith.
Speaker B:I really enjoyed your thoughtful questions and thanks so much for the work you do.
Speaker B:It's been a blast today.
Speaker A:Thank you.
